Again, two different solutions to a common problem. (If you think there is a sequence problem, look closely at the time zone codes.)
Subject: Change in policy
Date: 29 Jul 1999 00:59:12 -0000
From: "UUCF Chat" [Kurt Jensen]
To: "UUCF Chat"
Fellow list members,
I have changed all the lists to require my permission to join. A person from PA joined our lists and attempted to send a very obscene photo to us. LISTBOT doesn't allow big attachments so it didn't happen. However, he had my e-mail so guess what?
Anyway, from now on I will have to authorize new members on the list. I am doing this to keep e-mail predators off. If anyone else has been sent obscene e-mail recently and suspect it came from someone on these lists please let me know. Also, if anyone wants to manage the lists call me.
Sorry for any inconvience,
Kurt
Subject: Change In Policy
Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1999 22:16:16 -0400
From: Alex Machina
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Dear Birds:
I will not protect you from obscenity. You will have to learn to deal with it on your own. You're big boys and girls. I hope you can handle it. :)
--Alex
Your non-web, non-master, non-moderator
[Kurt Jensen, 29 Jul 1999 is quoted in full here.]
Subject: Re: Change In Policy
Date: Thu, 29 Jul 1999 00:03:07 -0400
From: [Patricia Harding-Clark]
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Dear Alex,
Since when were you protecting us from OBSCENITY?
The concept seems strange, considering the nature of our little chat group of UUCF fellow travelers.
I can't imagine any of us are going to send any OBSCENE messages to "Birds of a Feather."
Patricia
[Alex Machina, 28 Jul 1999, including its quote of Kurt Jensen, 29 Jul 1999, is quoted in full here.]
Subject: RE: Change In Policy
Date: Thu, 29 Jul 1999 11:31:21 -0400
From: [Alex Machina]
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [Patricia Harding-Clark]
> Sent: Thursday, July 29, 1999 00:03
>
> I can't imagine any of us are going to send any OBSCENE messages to
> "Birds of a Feather."
Patricia,
The issue is not that any of us who are current list members would do this. The issue is that since this is an Internet based email list, anyone who knows how and who chooses to do so, can subscribe to this list. Having done so, there is nothing to prevent this hypothetical person from sending anything he/she chooses to send.
Kurt, faced with this problem, has chosen to exercise an option in the software that prevents self-subscription to the UUCF-CHAT list. He will now exercise some control as to whether or not a given potential subscriber will be allowed to subscribe to the UUCF-CHAT list. There are also options in the software to prevent immediate distribution of a posting to all list subscribers (which he is not currently using). This allows a "moderator" to pre-screen the messages before they are actually forwarded to the subscribers.
My post was meant to emphasize that I am not utilizing any of those software options. This is a wide open list. We who are members post what we want when we want. This openness allows anyone, anywhere, who knows how, to post anything to this list without prescreening.
Subject: Re: Change In Policy
Date: Thu, 29 Jul 1999 11:37:57 EDT
From: [Marcia Helme]
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Alex,
Thanks. I'm glad to hear it. I would rather be warned that this list may, like any other email addres, sometimes receive obscene junk mail. I prefer a warning rather than censorship and blackballing. I suspect Kurt's motives. Every email address is subject to some obscene mail. So what? If I had young children, then I would take whatever steps I take with the other email that they read.
I never censored material available to my son. I tried to learn as much as I could about what input he was getting, and from where. Then, if I found it objectionable, I countered it with input of my own.
For example, when he was around 4, some of his friends told him that if he did so-and-so, God would send him to Hell. I told him that (1) our church did not believe in Hell, and (2) a lot of people in my church, including me, did not believe there was such a thing as God.
When he was curious about sexual practices, I answered him as best I could. I also recommended that if he didn't believe me, he could call Planned Parenthood sometime when his parents weren't around.
I was more upset about violence than about sex. I think I noted in a couple of instances, that such and such a picture showed Jack and Jill doing something sexual, but that I thought Jill wasn't enjoying it, and therefore I couldn't understand why the two of them were doing that.
When Steve was in college I learned why paper drives had been so popular in his boy scout troop. These paragons of youthful Amercian virtue enjoyed the opportunity to peruse, and often confiscate, Penthouse and Playboy.
I wonder if Boy Scouts still have paper drives. It's kind of weird to think that the leadership thinks it's not ok to have a gay scoutmaster, but it is ok for these preteens to spend their scout time perusing Penthouse and Playboy. I haven't looked at those recently, but it's my impression that there was a lot of violence mixed in with the sex.
Love,
Marcia
Subject: Re: Change In Policy
Date: Thu, 29 Jul 1999 15:33:24 EDT
From: [Lola Usack]
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Yup, I can do it. That little x does everything. Seriouly, though I don't
always join the dialogue, I enjoy reading. Thanks for starting it. Love,
Lola
Subject: Re: Re: Change In Policy
Date: Thu, 29 Jul 1999 20:42:44 EDT
From: [Marcia Helme]
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Lola,
I'm glad you can do it, but I don't know what "it" is.
Marcia
Subject: Re: Change In Policy
Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1999 16:47:49 EDT
From: Lola Usack
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Handle e-mail I didn't ask for. Marcia, how are you doing on the move? I can't help but wish you could stay here. Back to the e-mail. I think it was Alex, who wanted to know if we can handle the list as it is. I personally don't need a filter. I use the x button a lot on the pornographic spam that gets through. I hope all goes smoothly for you. Love, Lola
Subject: Re: Re: Change In Policy
Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 19:14:48 EDT
From: [Marcia Helme]
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Lola,
Thanks. I agree. Throwing out junki mail is relatively easy to do. I hate censorship in the name of "protection."
Marcia
Subject: Re: Change In Policy
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 15:58:37 EDT
From: [Lin]
To: [Birds Of A Feather List]
Dear Marcia:
I wanted to respond to you about the violence inherent in Playboy and Penthouse. I thought it might come easier from me, as I am a woman (not an obvious thing from either my e-mail name or my given name).
I have seen Playboy plenty of times, compared to most TV movies, it's pretty tame. Playboy even goes so far as to interview the women it photographs so that a set of likes and dislikes, desires and future goals are associated with those wonderful.... necks... And I am one of those women who actually READ the thing, hard to believe but some of us do.
Further, I do not believe that pornography is inherently evil. I wished that more women who felt as I do would actually do something to bring more love into the sex in pornography. I also do not believe that teenagers can be mislead by a video game to believe that violence is okay, or that playing Dungeons and Dragons can lead to violence (which I did constantly for years) or any of the myriad other things we blame for teen violence are actually to blame. However, I do believe that those things can harm and corrupt a young child who is not yet aware of the difference between fantasy and reality. For teenagers, this leads either to the harsh belief that parents and other adults are responsible for the murderous attitudes of some teens, or that those teens are suffering from some type of insanity or chemical imbalance. And maybe both is the case with kids like the murderers of Columbine High School.
Thank you, Alex, for keeping this an open forum. I am greatly enjoying all of the quick minds and deep thinkers who subscribe to this list, you included.
Lin